. /../AT&T, "The Internet.../ 1
written by Victavious on Jan 24, 2008 05:17
Sooo, I don't know if you heard about this already or even know what this is about but basically the idea of filtering at the network level by the big corporations , such as AT&T, was discussed at this year's CES. They said that this to counterattack piracy and to stop it for good. With them being able to to this they will be "scanning" every packet of data that is sent to and from your PC and to block it. By doing this they will (might) also be blocking songs, poems, stories, etc.. that were created by YOU and block them from you uploading them. Not only is that a possible problem but the fact of privacy for the internet users and ALSO the fact of the internet being the LAST true freedom and openness. There is one more factor that plays against it. Some people are saying that this could be a way ( in the future) to get rid of freedom of speech. So, what are your opinions on this subject???

linky: http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/01/08/att-and-other-isps-may-be-getting-ready-to-filter/
krush kill 'n destroy
written by Geekofdeath on Jan 24, 2008 12:11
Piracy.... addicting and troublesome. Wasting money. Everyone does it.

But this is certainly not the answer.

I never like AT&T much anyways.
hello! :) felysian
written by Hello! :) on Jan 24, 2008 20:45
There is no, and never was true freedom and openness on the internet, only deluded fantasies of such. Nor has there really been any privacy or security as well. Encryption. Enough said.
written by Azuraun2 on Jan 25, 2008 00:28
Well you're using their service, they can do whatever they want. Just boycott them and use another ISP, there's already sites based around internet freedom.

Now I don't completely know what I'm talking about (might be totally wrong), but, it'll probably slow down your connection speed, it might block legal things and it's an invasion of privacy like vic said. For the filter to be effective/accurate at all they'd have to scan entire files, slowing down the filter servers and downloads. And all these filter servers will cost them more money, so you'll either have to suffer a decently priced, but horribly slow and censored internet, or a fast, horribly expensive, censored internet. Or you could just use a decently priced, fast, and uncensored ISP. If I'm right at all, then there is definitely gonna be some customer complaints.
written by Deanfrz on Jan 25, 2008 04:04
I, for one, welcome our new Internet overlords, and wish to remind them that as a trusted leecher, I can help them find and prosecute seeders.
the bestest ever
written by Medeivalstargazer on Jan 25, 2008 04:40
Hello! said:
There is no, and never was true freedom and openness on the internet, only deluded fantasies of such. Nor has there really been any privacy or security as well. Encryption. Enough said.
No freedom of speech? Loo kat what you're doing right now. This forum. They're called forums because they are 'forums' in which to voice your opinions, a lot of the time without limitation. There is TOTAL freedom of speech on the internet, and I love it.

Deanfrz said:
I, for one, welcome our new Internet overlords, and wish to remind them that as a trusted leecher, I can help them find and prosecute seeders.
I seriously hope you're joking.
hello! :) felysian
written by Hello! :) on Jan 25, 2008 09:04
Medeivalstargazer said:
No freedom of speech? Loo kat what you're doing right now. This forum. They're called forums because they are 'forums' in which to voice your opinions, a lot of the time without limitation. There is TOTAL freedom of speech on the internet, and I love it.
I suppose trolls, flame-baiters, jerks, and the like are free to speak their opinion in such a way that everyone finds it offensive?

Yes, I know there is freedom, under written and unwritten social etiquette. However, I was responding to the comment about true freedom. True freedom doesn't exist, at least if attempted, it is nothing more than short-lived failure.

In regards to the openness, there are at least two ways to view it. In regards to software, and in regards to personal lives.

For software, only the software (and source code) that is public domain (or has no license, though I have not actually seen copyrighted software that is not put it under some sort of license) is really open. For all other software users usually do not own the copy they use. What legally happens is the user only licenses the usage of the software.

In regards to personal lives, I would wager that 80% - 90% of the people on the internet do not accurately represent themselves, use some form of deception to mask themselves, or allow others to make incorrect assumptions. Even though they may publish various media (blogs, video blogs) about themselves I would not call it being open.

Ergo, there is no true freedom and openness.

Also to those saying it is an invasion of privacy. You are too late. I would say there has not been any privacy on the internet for the last 10 or so years. Even with high-grade/DoD-standard encryption to protect content there are still more than enough ways for others* to identify you.

Meh, enough ranting/sort of ranting. It's late and I'm not thinking so clearly.

* When I say others, I am including advertising sites, any site that requires you to submit any information (even if it is just a username or password), regular internet users.
written by Victavious on Jan 25, 2008 19:22
Yeh, I agree that there isn't and hasn't been any TRUE privacy on the net.

For a few examples, when you do a search in any search engine they keep the keyword and your IP and they flag anything that they think is "bad" and the only difference between the search engines are the times that they keep that data, like Google keeps it for 18 months and yahoo is about 12, I think. Another thing is that the Yahoo web browser has built-in spy ware.

The main problem that I have with AT&T doing this is the fact of them being able to block incoming and outgoing of things that THEY think are copyrighted.

And about freedom of speech on the net, thats a "so-so" thing. MOSt of the time we do have freedom of speech but there has been some times, specially this past year, when some people have been in trouble for something they post and have been "forced" to remove it or another body has removed it.
hello! :) felysian
written by Hello! :) on Jan 25, 2008 22:45
Victavious said:
The main problem that I have with AT&T doing this is the fact of them being able to block incoming and outgoing of things that THEY think are copyrighted.
ISP = Internet Service Provider
TOS = Terms of Service
Since an ISP is providing a service, they make the user agree to certain TOS a legally binding contract. The contract most likely states that using the service provided for illegal activities is not allowed. There also is most likely a clause that states that they can deny service for violating the TOS. Therefore the ISP filtering content going through their network is within their legal right. All the user can do is whine, complain, and/or change ISPs. It is not an invasion of privacy. You have no legal ownership over your internet connection, though if you are a shareholder it is possible to argue that you partly own your connection. However, unless you are a majority holder it would not be enough to have any sort of effect.

I'm not sure if you are aware, but this really doesn't surprise me a month or two ago I stubled across an article that said comcast was blocking BitTorrent. It's really no different than what AT&T is doing, aside from spoofing origin, it is within their legal right to block bittorrent traffic. The only part where I question the legality is the fraudulent packets used.
http://www.google.com/search?q=eff+bittorrent+comcast

Edit: I forgot to say, that it is within their legal right to block traffic at their choosing whether it is for legitimate purposes or not.
krush kill 'n destroy
written by Geekofdeath on Jan 26, 2008 01:45
I'm certain that when Generation Y (or whatever they call my generation these days) finally begins to retire, they will brood about how great the days of the World Wild Web had been, when everyone was able to get away with anything; they will remember the days of the lawless and revolutionary land of cyberspace; the days of pirates, ninjas, griefers, n00bs, abusive people-owners, and flamers while forming fanatical clans, vehement guilds and busily engaging in truly horrendous things to their hardware; cracking and hacking other peoples' PCs, spreading dangerous viruses, searching for and ridding themselves of mere cookies, hunting for dangerous bugs, compressing important documents, using crawlers over the web, getting angry at their old drivers, defending themselves with powerful firewalls, fighting in flamewars, searching for hotspots, using killer apps, bombing Google and sending mailbombs and malware, hitting their slow mice, patching their programs up, saving their screens, surfing the web under torrents, combating trojans, consulting wizards, destroying worms, ripping and burning all of their CDs*, crashing, booting and rebooting their computers, cutting files off their floppy discs before finally ending their day with the horrifying blue stare of Death itself.

In the future, I'm pretty sure that you would not be able to get away with nearly as much crap as now. Enforced order will certainly follow this glorious revolution.

* Not that CDs, much less Blu-rays will exist anymore.
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